it has to be price. I'm guessing that Take 2 set quite a rigid trade price and ASDA didn't like it and can't go out at £25.

hope this was related to price.

this game will sell out regardless and without the crazy discounting stores will happily re-order through the correct trade channels.

if this is correct stores should praise Rockstar/Take 2

Good on Take 2 - If the case is price then I Applaud Take 2's stance on the supermarkets. Why should they get cheaper stock.

It has been proved today that without Asda selling this game We Indies have flourished selling Take 2's AAA in the 1,000s and we have all benn ordering more and more and more from GEM and wherever else we can get them from

lets hope all the Publishers Grow a pair and stand up to all Supermarkets

Maybe this is the first sign of games producers retaliating against loss leading supermarkets? Maybe. It'll be interesting to how (or if) this is resolved and if it leads to similar incidents in the future

Other publishers should take note and gain more respect from the specialist stores.

Games like Red dead redemption will sell just as well at £39.99 than at £25 and i feel the correct distribution channel (Gem etc) will get many more re-orders as a result of this.

surely this is the way forward with more stable prices in future

RESPECT TO TAKE 2/ROCKSTAR if this is the case.

Round of applause from us for Take2 as well.

Now if we can just rid ourselves of the other Supermarkets . . . .

i went to buy it this afternoon and i was told by the guy behind the counter that asda were not selling them due to a rape scene in the game......

crap! you're lying. or the counter man is. gotta be a trade price dispute surely

purekillforce (7)

it seems they are happy to sell online very odd situation

purekillforce(7)
it seems they are still happy to sell online?

you should have a good moan at there customer service desk for wasting your time.

I believe Online is outsourced

jon,
i asked him about online and he said he knows they are still shown on the website, but he wasn't sure if orders were being shipped or what was going on. this was just a cashier for the entertainment department. not a manager or anything.

it's up to you how reliable you think he is. i'm just passing on what i was told.

i ended up going to argos where it was only £35 anyway. worked out for me!

Its got to be more than a cost price issue. That wouldn't stop a supermarket form taking a AAA title. Despite what you Indies think the supermarkets/Game/HMV etc. don't get that much of a price break. Most publishers work to a set of price breaks. In order to get full discount you need to moving £Ms with each publisher. And when the Supermarkets sell at £25 or whatever they're losing money. Fact.

Perhaps the stock mountain of Bioshock 2 has something to do with it.

Asda 'We aint takin it until you clear up the Bioshock mess'

T2 'Sorry, its not in our budget'

Asda 'We won't take any new titles until you clear the mess up'

T2 'Your call, but we aint gonna sort out the mess'

Asda 'Ok we aint taking your feckin western title then'

T2 'Fair enough'

Asda Seeing sales fly 'D'OH!'

Official stance this morning was "asda not stocking in stores for the time being, it is however, available online"

online games are outsourced so no real issues there. I cant see a problem with supermarkets selling games. Many come in at almost £40 anyway and havent sold big new release at £25 for quite some time . . . . .

And above is correct, most recent game and film releases have been sold at a ridiculous loss, just ask a staff member to scan the item and tell you!

And what of the consumer? Ah yes, I forgot as long as the Indies can continue to charge the highest price for games consumer choice doesn't come into it. Nice attitude guys. I'm beginning to see why so many champion a digital distribution future.

Do you honestly think digital distribution will be cheap,

It is the infighting of the retail groups and indies that drive the prices down.

The publishers want to drive prices up.

No competition, consumer loses!

why do people think supermarkets are loosing money fast, they loose money fast on the game for 1 weekend but put 2p on milk or booze the same weekend, supermarkets dont loose money, they make money, didnt you see the anual profits released ? always in the millions.
It would be great if publishers held on price even to bulk sales, but i cant see it. Publishers want to end used games, but new games are too high, i know we will sell loads less new if used is stopped, new games need to be lower in price to start with.

Sorry joe mr retail is correct with the above comment. even selling red dead at £40 indy's wont make enough money to cover overheads. Business need to make money to run. that also applies to hmv game and gs they will make hardly anything on £40 retail price. I'd sooner money go there than supermarkets (Just opinion)

Generally its cheaper than buying from the high street now, so yes it will be cheaper. I used to firmly believe that the games industy would always need the high street, yet current evidence strongly suggests otherwise. Retailers, Indies particularly, seem to be entertaining the idea that the industry can't survive without them. This is utter nonsense, if anything bricks and mortar trading is holding it back.

I think the industry can survive quite happily without some of the bad-indies and the bad-supermarkets.

But you must admit some of the shenanigans between somefrom some publishers (not T2) has been really destroying perfectly good and well respected businesses.

It has also had the effect of polarising the avaiabilty of product in stores, you can probably find the top 20-50 games without too much bother. and you can find the junk in the campaigns & sales. but finding some slightly more obscure titles can be a nightmare!

Recently as you will have seen, many games have had exclusive dlc content when bought from one store or another. But nothing provided to the indies. This really has unfairly shifted the customer spend away from stores that havent done anything wrong.

I do honestly fee long term that digital will be more expensive, Sky Box Office (pay per view) is more expensive than renting from Blockbuster, yet has dramatically lower running costs.

The record industry made a big mistake with itunes and didnt control the pricing. so it destroyed their more profitable retail routes.

I dont think the video game industry will let their ip's go the same way.

sorry should have read 'without some of the bad-indies and some of the bad-supermarkets'

and by bad-supermarkets I mean the ones who advertise a product at a low price and cant even be bothered to put stock in every branch! and just use it to generate footfall

"Recently as you will have seen, many games have had exclusive dlc content when bought from one store or another. But nothing provided to the indies. This really has unfairly shifted the customer spend away from stores that havent done anything wrong."

"But you must admit some of the shenanigans between somefrom some publishers (not T2) has been really destroying perfectly good and well respected businesses."

Unfair it may seem, but in reality no one owes any high street business a living.

I'll be completely honest with you, and speaking as a consumer, as long as I can get the games I want and at a price I consider to be good value I don't care how said product reaches me. As it stands I see no reason to to shop in the indies and places like GAME when they're consistantly being outpriced by the supers, online and digital distrubution.

As I said earlier, I always used to champion the high street but of recent that view has changed dramatically, especially where digital distribution is concerned where the vast majority of games via Steam, XBL and PSN are substantially cheaper than on the high street.

Some may argue "But ahh, where will you trade your games if there was no hard copies?", and to be fair it was an argument I once put toward a friend, but as he rightly said; if games are cheaper via digital distribution why would I have the need of trade-ins in the first place? Quite simply, I wouldn't.

As I've said many time before. It may be a harsh reality for many a high street games retailer but times are changing; you can either adapt or die out.

Can I agree with you on many points.

Not only do I own and run a video game business, we do have a retail presence, but heavily online. But I am also a consumer.

Games are too expensive, but at the moment, the consumer is benefiting as the difference between RRP and the price you pay is being funded by the retailer. and obviously in some cases the retailler is paying more to the publisher than you pay the retailler.

game prices need to come down, and not as suggested by some publishers (Namco Bandai interview is worth reading in MCV this week) by eliminating chunks of the game to give less, a tv movie instead of a blockbuster!

If a PS3 or 360 game was 29.99 rrp, and sold for £25 or so at retail, a version you can trade, lend, sell, beg, borrow etc -versus- a digital copy that dies with your console for £15 - £20. Which would you buy, ok sometimes you buy the digtal, othertimes the physical.

At the moment the indies are being killed off by the RRP being too high and the Supermarkets/Amazon et al being the saviour.

We need more realistic pricing.

And this is just not limited just to the games market, look at dvd/bluray, the studios are asking £25 for some releases, yet the supermarkets are financing it down to £10 - £12.

I agree with the customer wanting the best deal, but the current model is not sustainable, the retailer (regardless of Amazon,supermarket) should not be fixing the ridiculous RRPs to a level the consumer wants to pay.

Even on the indies charging higher prices than the multiples, most are still less than RRP. The fact we regard the indies prices as high (or extortinate) shows that the RRP is flawed in the first place.

I am completely bemused to read some comments in favor of the rip-off price asked by the games retailers. If Asda wants to sell the game cheaper that's good news. Especially when it relates to product like games, where half of the customers are hysterical.
I even saw a shop selling it at 120 £ (on Amzon).

Personally I went to Game in Camberley, where I bought Battlefield 2 a couple of months ago for 40 quid. When I saw RDR at 50 I went back home without buying it.

So I don't care about the quality of the game. Rockstar games are not always good and this game is only the first in the series. If we keep buying at any cost, next time we'll have to pay at least a hundred quid for GT5, and when I consider that the PS3 format cannot be copied unlike the other one, I find that quite disgusting.

the publishers have set the RRP at 49.99, why blame the retailer if they are selling at the RRP.

More blame should be levelled at the publishers, who ultimately determine what the stores can buy it for and in turn the consumers.

a game cheaper in one store to another doesnt make it a rip off,
retailers try to sell products to make a small profit to cover costs and make a living, just because its cheaper in asda and they use lost leaders to lower the price to increase footfall and market share doesnt actually make other retailers rip offs, just means that indies who only sell games cant compete as they dont have 2 million other products to increase in price to cover the lost leader.
The customer will always want the best deal and this is up to them to seek it out, but as a retailer its so painful to see aggressive pricing by supermarkets just to force customers out of indies and into supermarkets, its seems this country wont be happy until there are only supermarkets and no other shops. When i shop of course i want the lowest price but i can see it from both sides, you can only sell a game at a certain price to make a living as an indie, not to rip people off, you cant sell lower than you paid at supply, this is why so many stores close.Supermarkets + web killed the music industry, once games have been taken over they will move on to another sector.

We sold our BF2 Badcompany in store at 39.99, our RDR is on the shelf at 44.99, £5 less than the local branch of Game. Ok if Game had theirs at 39.99 we would match it;

we sell our bad company 2 brand new for 34.99 as we get a good deal on bundle stock, we always try to give the best price we can, but if the game is £37 inc vat you cant sell it for £25 to match a supermarket we sell at 39.99 we are not a rip off we are selling to make £3 profit,
customers just dont understand that

"we are not a rip off we are selling to make £3 profit,
customers just dont understand that"

And why should they understand that? In fact, why should customers even care?

You may not like it, but the fact remains: Your inability to compete with the majors is your problem, NOT the consumers. Again, you're just another retailer acting like everyone owes you a living. Well here's the news: we don't.

I'm sure all the indies complaining about supermarkets shop there weekly and don't care about the highstreet butchers, bakers and other stores that were put out of business by progress. Until it comes to games and then it's a different matter. Hypocrites.

At the fact people think that trying to make a profit (even a small one) is somehow morally reprehensible. I work in publishing a personally I welcome retailers who try to observe the SRPs as closely as possible.

Just because one retailer is able and willing to lash stock out at cost, that another is ripping you off because they're making some margin. Please don't forget that games are a luxury. Nobody owes you anything and doesnt have to knock games out a stupidly low price.

i dont think anyone owes me anything let alone a living, why is the same bullshit comments each week on here, the reason we are even talking about this is because this is TRADE website for people in this trade/industry, and the funny thing is i avoid supermarkets like the plague, i support my local green grocer and butcher thanks, please dont come on here and assume you know someone, its pure arrogance.
We try our best to be better on price, and im not sayin customers should care or need to care about our difficuties, im simply dicussing this topic with other retailers, hence this site being a trade website.
So drop all the typical moaning indie comments and the world owes me a living, im sure the music indsutry has exactly the same issues.
maybe if if was your family who paid their mortage or feed their kids directly from their games business you would not see things in black and white and have some mature insight instead of looking at things just from a customers point of view.I dont feel hard done to or think its unfair, im just commenting on difficulties within this business.

Trade magazine or not this is an open forum and as such consumer point of view is as valid as retailers. Your whole aggressive attitude is clearly more than just an opinion, Paul and does smack of someone feeling hard done by.

jm3811 - It's actually the second game in the series. The first, Red Dead Revolver was released some years back on Xbox and PS2.

no my aggressive attitude is towards people who pigeon hole me, when they have no idea what so ever about me, my shopping habits, or where i work. I also never said consumers views are not valid, everyone is a consumer and i can see both sides, problem is the consumers on here who are not retailers dont see both sides, they just see price, this is fine but as i pointed out for some people this is about feeding their family.If i come across aggressive its because this is quite simply ground hog day. If you were to loose your job and i said oh well ha ha hard luck had to happen, you would think this closed minded and arrogant. All im saying is things are not black and white as some people seem to suggest in their comments here.we try to adapt to the changing business, im not going to cry about supermarkets we just have to change, its just frustrating when your a small business and cant use lost leaders and other tactics to push your business more.
I actually think there is room for everyone, problem is the supermarkets dont want this they want to dominate and i mean overall, food, consumer goods, insurance, the whole pie.
This is why i continue to support local butchers etc.

i actually felt like this years before i working in the games industry, i dont like faceless supermarkets, i have a big problem with them anyway, this isnt just about games, its about the death of the high street and the empty towns with nothing more than antique shops, estate agents, coffee shops.

Not sure if you're industry or not (I like to think everyone on here is and therefore has some sort of actual knowledge of how things work) BUT I think you were fed a line by the staff at ASDA, most people in the industry know that ASDA staff (and the staff of other supermarkets for that matter) are clueless when it comes to knowing about the products they sell. It’s the "if it's not on the shelf, we don't have it mentality". It’s not their fault, they’re just not trained well enough. I know myself that most of them turn up to work each day not knowing what department they’ll spend the day in.

as for the "real" reason, well there are a number of factors in play with any and all deals done between retailers and publishers. A lot of it is to do with price, but other issues are at play too, someone in here quite rightly pointed out that there may be stock issues with previous titles, but Trade Marketing and General Marketing support plays a part as well. I’m not sure that any one of these single issues would result in a title this big not being stocked. I imagine it would be a combination of all of them. Only 2 parties will ever know the true reason and I can't imagine they will be coming on here any time soon.

Lesson learnt though. 100% distribution isn't needed to ensure success in the charts. Well done rockstar and all involved, it's a refreshing change to see a new (ish) ip succeed.

PS - people please check your spelling and grammar before you post, it does makes things difficult to read when you spell stuff wrong and miss words out. Been instead of being, there instead of their – you get the idea. We’re supposed to be professionals remember.

@Joe: Publishers want DD to take total control of price and sale... if it ever happens, prepare for prices to rise to never seen before heights. The tone has already been set by games like GT5P, dearer digitally than it was retail. Cut out the middleman, and those RRP's that everyone doesn't sell the games for, will be mandatory. Games will rise by at least £10 overnight...

Also, be prepared for more bug filled games to be released. While people buy discs, the publishers can only assume online connectivity in order to release patches. If they can guarantee a connection, they'll throw any old crap out there with a view to "fixing it later".

Unfortunately, couch-potato culture can't see beyond the "great, I don't have to get lazy ass out of my chair, to get a new game". Pray we never get full DD. All it offers is job losses, higher prices and less excercise.

Cynical my friend.

not sure your arguments stands either, don't forget that publishers will still have to compete against each other as they do at the moment, it's just that if retail weren't about they would be in direct competition with each other.

i think iTunes is a good example of the case in point. on there the music labels (and movie labels to a lesser extent) are in direct competition with each other, with much more direct access to the consumers yet we don't see massive price hikes on there do we? I'm sure it's simply a case of SRP being adhered to. In the case of GT5P, am I not right correct in thinking that the DLC price was the SRP and it was the retail price that was £5 cheaper rather than the DLC being £5 more, if that makes sense.

I think you're right though prices will go up, but only to current SRP's which I as a consumer won't mind because as a member of the publishing community I know how much time and effort goes into each and every release.

Also, on the point about quality, to suggest that a publisher will "throw any old crap" out there is completely off the mark, I don't buy your reasoning at all. Publishers will be selling directly to the consumer, it's therefore fair to assume that their names will become more commonplace in the mind of the consumer. That means that crap product will be to the detriment of the publishers reputation. Think of it as you buying crap veg from Tesco, after a few occasions you will stop buying veg from Tesco won't you? If the end consumer repeatedly buys crap product directly from a publisher they will eventually stop buying it won’t they?

personally i always go to the supermarket for my ps3 games. im not fussed about high street retailers anymore. id rather wait a few wks for a game to become "preowned" if i cant get it cheap on launch day. i personally got my Red Dead from Sainsburys on launch day for £28.99.
And im all for DD - if it keeps costs low. who in their right mind in this day of age is gonna pay £50+ for a game?!!? not a chance mate !!

For someone who claims he doesn't feel anyone owes him a living you sure do like to keep telling everyone how poor you are and many bills you have to pay out. Guess what? That's your problem.i

the magical welth of knowlege from the biggest wanka on here,
ive not posted anything on here about my bills, ive already stated i accepted the challenge of business and from supermarkets we just adapt, our rental system is thriving, when people cant afford a new game they rent it, then pick it up 2nd hand, mind you had to send my staff into tesco early today to clear out red dead, gald they dropped their bulk buy policy good news for all retailers !!
also nice getting my stock on a wednesday from play sold so many on wedesday good news travels fast!

this post is kind of pointless since soon supermarkets and game shops wont be selling games, once online services take over, i cant see another xbox or playstation being released, look at music, why buy a cd,when on xmas day you can download your new cd to your ipod doesnt matter what time of day, servers are never closed.
Software and game retail days are numbered

Your views don't follow any logical pattern at all and are completely unfounded.99% of games via digital distribution are cheaper than their high street counterparts, if you used systems such as steam you would know this and clearly you don't. Sorry, but for a retailer you're painfully out of touch with the constantly changing industry you claim to be a part of.

"mind you had to send my staff into tesco early today to clear out red dead, gald they dropped their bulk buy policy good news for all retailers !!
also nice getting my stock on a wednesday from play sold so many on wedesday good news travels fast!"

And you wonder why the industry doesn't bend over backwards to accomodate the indies? You're your own worst enemy, Paul.

the one thing i find terribly sad is people actually welcoming shop closures, oh thats your problem, yes of course its not mine either, but why do you all have to relish in someone elses misfortune, they are just trying to make a living like anyone, and come now joe, if you were a shop would you buy a game at 38 quid inc vat from supply or buy it for 34.99 inc vat to sell for 39.99, come on does it matter where the game is from im sure its still sealed, most shop owners on here seem to be still in business because of adapting like this, its not illegal to buy and resell, what about people who buy multiple spec ed games just to put on ebay? these guys are only trying to make a £5 profit and if the shops here are anything like my game shop most is done on trade ins and not straight sales.
i just dont understand all the hate towards retail, they are just trying to survive and doing it legally. whats wrong with you people?

@paul Johnson

i can see what you are saying but if someone i knew bought me a download on Christmas and their was no presents under the tree i would not be happy. Consumers like to be able to go out and hold the product in their hands i know i do. Downloading is easy but i still prefer to have the CD and not the download any day

"come now joe, if you were a shop would you buy a game at 38 quid inc vat from supply or buy it for 34.99 inc vat to sell for 39.99"

Actually helped a couple of friends set up their own independent games store at which I worked at for a time, so I'm well versed in the up hill struggles presented to the sector. Would I ever open my own store? In the current climate and the industries current drive towards a new business model -not on your nelly.

I won't speak for the everyone else, but for my part its got nothing to do with 'hating the retailers' or 'wishing their business to go under', I'm just being realistic; there's no long term future in bricks and mortar games retail.

MCV, i assume Paul Johnson, as a retailer subscribes to your trade magazine? If so surely you have his details and should report him to the relevant parties for openly admitting to breaking street dates?

nice 1 jb, makes no difference, when we order from play.com they send out on tuesdays so we sell our games on wed, i couldnt care less who you report me too, retail is on its way out, no matter if the customer prefers boxed product, why would a company interested in profit care what some of their customers think, so long as profit contiunes, i will do what ever to stay open for the next few years, we all know its coming to an end, jb get a life and maybe a boyfriend and stop telling teacher on me, come on grow up, at least i dont sell r4 and mod consoles like some shops close to me, along with copied movies under the counter.
ive not signed any street date agreements for years, still get my stock, most online site spost out early, better report them all jb you moron.

Paul, just stop posting, you're just embarrasing yourself.

Very true, techgamer, very true.

"why would a company interested in profit care what some of their customers think, so long as profit continues," you really don't care what your customers think? perhaps it's time to get your coat.

you spelt continues wrong as BTW

I have read your posts on other topics you are a speak your mind person can't think of any indy that doesn't do the same game and gs sent staff to buy from tesco etc. so the big boys do the same. i use steam and i can find most games on steam cheaper as a physical copy so that isn't true. Online retail is a joke cos they blame royal mail for early or late dispatch we arn't stupid if you get a game early you buy from there again. It is dog eat dog and when you read comments you can see who runs a business and who doesn't. and who cares about spelling we are all wrong and right the industry in going into a revolution lets se how it spans out? i buy physical copies of games cos it takes me about 10 mins to get it online got to wait for del and download even with excellent speed still hours to get a game. good 5+ years left in bricks and mortar and bluray media is still new. loads of traded games still have dlc codes in them because not every 1 is online or willing to pay for it. we are all pritty narrow minded.

you know things are going bad when someone picks up on your bad spelling did you understand my comment? great point you won from me there. What im saying is if a large company wants to go digital only and 40% of customers prefer boxed product the company WILL do as they please.If it keeps costs down and profits up im sure they wouldnt think twice about a customer who isnt interested in download only, plus who really cares about this tiny island, do we really matter in the world wide scale of sales? i doubt it.
retro junkie finally someone who gets it, i agree maybe 5 years left in bricks and mortar. techgamer wow insightful comment and worth some serious thought, enjoy your comments

I can confirm that ASDA will be stocking RDR from 4th June, priced £39.72 on both PS3 and XBOX.

Asda have missed the boat with this one, even is they went in at a low price point.

Can't believe all these people on the tired old price arguement again. Publishers and retailers want to make money - fact: generally speaking retail margins are higher than publisher margins.

The cost of development is going up not down and so if you want lower prices you need to cut costs - which means lower quality or shorter games. So is that what the consumer wants.

Sure, some games do well and sell loads and people make a lot of money. But these only help offset the loses made on a loda of other games. If you want developers and publishers to keep investing in new IP for example and taking that risk then they need to stand a chance to make money.

Back to the point. I'm glad if it was ASDA trying to push a price down again the publisher said no. We all love games and the industry so why don't we start supporting that. In other categories all retailers talk about adding category value - why can't everyone in this category? Games still represent better value for money hour for pound than DVD's or going to the movie's, or many other pass times...

I think the sales of the limited editions are what encourage me more to spend the full price, and you don't see many Lim Ed games at super stores. the problem with this is that it's only the Triple A games that get these. I keep myself to one full price game a month a) because I have 3 kids and it's all I can afford without my wife calling for a divorce every month and b) because we're lucky if theres even ONE decent AAA title a month. IMO if the publishers keep producing more in the way of drivel instead of the full on "Must have" games, NOBODY is going to part with 40+ cash for a game that is done in a couple of hours regardless of who sells it.

I like Prince of Persia but I shelled out 49.99 for the limited edition Red Dead at GameStation (Just like I did for Mass Effect 2) and I think it was worth every penny, and I can't be the only one that thinks so. And I'll do the same for HALO Reach in September at £100+. Can anybody tell me of a game that will be out in the mean time (between May and September) that will also give me that value for money? seriously think about it.

I think we can all see who's spending more time on the PC behind the counter argueing on the internet and not looking after the business infront of him.

It's an industry forum and you've no idea who you are arguing against.

I'm not so sure he owns the business, probably just works there because no one that retarded could possibly have the required business acumen to set up their own business. Or, at best, I imagine he owns one of these semi-shop stalls you see in indoor markets, probably the remnants of an old Pink Planet outlet. Saw one of those in Sailsbury one time. Bloody horrible little dump.